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Critical Thinking vs Comprehension

Page history last edited by Shaun 13 years, 3 months ago

Transcript from September 29

All times are GMT

 
September 29, 2010
8:00 pm olafelch: So, let's go: To what extent is critical thinking beyond mere comprehension important for language learning? #ELTchat
8:01 pm Marisa_C: #ELTchat Let's go: To what extent is critical thinking beyond mere comprehension important for language learning? #ELTchat
8:01 pm olafelch: I'd like to start of by asking about the word "mere" in the question. Is comprehension "mere"? #ELTchat
8:01 pm EveWeb: An #ELTChat will start in 5 minutes. To what extent is critical thinking beyond mere comprehension important for language learning?
8:01 pm CELT_Athens: RT @Marisa_C: #ELTchat Let's go: To what extent is critical thinking beyond mere comprehension important for language learning? #ELTchat
8:01 pm CELT_Athens: RT @olafelch: I'd like to start of by asking about the word "mere" in the question. Is comprehension "mere"? #ELTchat
8:02 pm Marisa_C: RT @olafelch: I'd like to start of by asking about the word "mere" in the question. Is comprehension "mere"? #ELTchat
8:02 pm Shaunwilden: @olafelch Can we just answer 'very' ;-) No seriously I think its vital esp with younger students #ELTchat:
8:02 pm DaveDodgson: It's important for developing reflective skills e.g self-assessment #eltchat
8:02 pm BethCagnol: Got my marshmallows. Bag of cookies. Glass o'milk. Music playin'. Time for another good ol' #ELTchat!
8:03 pm esolcourses: RT @DaveDodgson: It's important for developing reflective skills e.g self-assessment #eltchat
8:03 pm Marisa_C: @olafelch I suppose by 'mere' we mean lifting facts off a text - stated or implied #ELTchat
8:03 pm Shaunwilden: RT @DaveDodgson: It's important for developing reflective skills e.g self-assessment #eltchat
8:03 pm DaveDodgson: RT @Shaunwilden: I think its vital esp with younger students #ELTchat <---- Very much agree!
8:03 pm esolcourses: @bethcagnol LOL! sounds seriously organised... Like it! #ELTchat
8:04 pm ShellTerrell: RT @olafelch: So, let's go: To what extent is critical thinking beyond mere comprehension important for language learning? #ELTchat
8:04 pm ShellTerrell: RT @olafelch: I'm following #ELTchat on TweetGrid http://tweetgrid.com/
8:04 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: @olafelch I suppose by 'mere' we mean lifting facts off a text - stated or implied #ELTchat thats how I understood it
8:04 pm Marisa_C: RT @BethCagnol: Got my marshmallows. Bag of cookies. Glass o'milk. Music playin'. Time for another good ol' #ELTchat! Glass of wine here!
8:04 pm ShellTerrell: RT @DaveDodgson: It's important for developing reflective skills e.g self-assessment #eltchat
8:05 pm olafelch: @Marisa_C ...and that would seem to be the goal of many learners. Is it for us to tell the learners that their goals are wrong? #ELTchat
8:05 pm BethCagnol: @Marisa_C @olafelch #ELTchat Mere: bare(a): apart from anything else; without additions or modifications;
8:05 pm EveWeb: I guess it depends on the student's age. RT @olafelch: I'd like to start of by asking about the word "mere" in the question. #ELTchat
8:05 pm Marisa_C: So to go beyond the 'mere' and move to critical, what levels of comprehension or what activities would you suggest as important #eltchat
8:05 pm harrisonmike: Looooong day tomorrow. Good night all. Enjoy #eltchat =
8:06 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: So to go beyond the 'mere' and move to critical, what levels of comprehension or what activities would you suggest as important #eltchat
8:06 pm olafelch: @EveWeb I agree, but I would also add ability to that. #ELTchat
8:06 pm personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:06 pm CELT_Athens: @olafelch Some learners, especially beginners may have a hard time to express more than 'mere' not for lack of thought but.... #ELTchat
8:07 pm CELT_Athens: ...for lack of language to express selves #eltchat
8:07 pm ShellTerrell: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:07 pm DaveDodgson: Why do we want our learners to think critically? #eltchat
8:07 pm DaveDodgson: RT @CELT_Athens: @olafelch Some learners, especially beginners may have a hard time to express more than 'mere' not for lack of thought but.... #ELTchat
8:07 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: to go beyond 'mere' + move to critical, what activities would u suggest as important #eltchat - asking abt mood, tone of text
8:07 pm Shaunwilden: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:07 pm EveWeb: Or student's language level. It can be 'mere' if we refer to 'basic' comprehension or 'basic' understanding #ELTChat
8:07 pm OUPELTGlobal: @Marisa_C Critical thinking can help students connect to the content in ways simple comprehension can't #eltchat
8:08 pm hoprea: Hmm... I guess it's important for learners to learn to think critically in any area of education. #ELTChat
8:08 pm BethCagnol: #ELTchat Critical thinking requires training. It's not automatic. Especially for students with learning difficulties.
8:08 pm olafelch: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, and creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:08 pm CELT_Athens: RT @Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: to go beyond 'mere' : #eltchat - asking abt mood, tone of text > then evaluating ideas in text
8:08 pm esolcourses: RT @hoprea: Hmm... I guess it's important for learners to learn to think critically in any area of education. #ELTChat
8:08 pm ShellTerrell: For ESP classes and business English many of the companies who pay for the courses expect their employees to critical think in Eng #ELTChat
8:08 pm ShellTerrell: RT @OUPELTGlobal: @Marisa_C Critical thinking can help students connect to the content in ways simple comprehension can't #eltchat
8:09 pm hoprea: RT @BethCagnol: #ELTchat Critical thinking requires training. It's not automatic. Especially for stdt with learning difficulties. #ELTChat
8:09 pm Marisa_C: @Shaunwilden ...evaluating ideas, evaluating language? #eltchat
8:09 pm BloggersELT: @DaveDodgson we need to help them recognize hidden meanings and agendas in text; hidden by "nice" language #eltchat
8:09 pm Marisa_C: RT @OUPELTGlobal: @Marisa_C Critical thinking can help students connect to the content in ways simple comprehension can't #eltchat
8:09 pm esolcourses: RT @ShellTerrell: For ESP classes and business English many of the companies who pay for the courses expect their employees to critical think in Eng #ELTChat
8:09 pm olafelch: @CELT_Athens I agree. My gut feeling is that critical thinking is something for later on in the development process. #ELTchat
8:09 pm ShellTerrell: If we are teaching pilots aviator English isn't it important they can use critical thinking skills in Eng to think on their toes #ELTChat
8:10 pm ShellTerrell: Agree! RT @esolcourses: RT @hoprea: I guess it's important for learners to learn to think critically in any area of education. #ELTChat
8:10 pm EveWeb: To make SS understand the language use RT @DaveDodgson: Why do we want our learners to think critically? #eltchat
8:10 pm Marisa_C: RT @ShellTerrell: For ESP classes many of the companies who pay for the courses expect their employees to critical think in Eng #ELTChat
8:10 pm Shaunwilden: Its very hard fotr sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when their own education systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:10 pm hoprea: Don't learners, especially older ones, think critically about everything they're exposed to? #ELTChat
8:11 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Shaunwilden: Its very hard fotr sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when their own education systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:11 pm ShellTerrell: RT @hoprea: Don't learners, especially older ones, think critically about everything they're exposed to? #ELTChat
8:11 pm DaveDodgson: @ShellTerrell Aren't such skills transferable from non-ELT fields? #eltchat
8:11 pm olafelch: @ShellTerrell Isn't that advanced analysis, rather than critical thinking? #ELTChat
8:11 pm hoprea: I mean, if we ask our students to express their views on certain topics, and support it logically, with arguments, what is that? #ELTChat
8:11 pm Marisa_C: I think we might want to clarify what we mean - teahing CT or encouraging critical reading? Can we narrow down? #eltchat
8:11 pm cybraryman1: My Critical Thinking page: http://bit.ly/9n44v3 #ELTchat
8:11 pm Shaunwilden: @Marisa_C Yes, do you remember the old CPE exam that used 2 ask ?s like that in the use of English part B? I used 2 love that part #ELTchat:
8:11 pm DaveDodgson: RT @Shaunwilden: Its very hard fotr sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when their own education systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:11 pm olafelch: RT @Shaunwilden: Its very hard fotr sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when their own education systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:11 pm hoprea: RT @Marisa_C: I think we might want to clarify what we mean - teahing CT or encouraging critical reading? Can we narrow down? #ELTChat
8:11 pm esolcourses: RT @hoprea Don't learners, especially older ones, think critically about everything they're exposed to? #ELTChat ] not sure I'd agree
8:12 pm esolcourses: RT @Shaunwilden: Its very hard fotr sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when their own education systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:12 pm ShellTerrell: @hoprea I would agree that most older learners do think critically #eltchat
8:12 pm BethCagnol: @hoprea #eltchat They might. But everything is a stretch, I think.
8:12 pm Marisa_C: One does not exclude the other so by engaging Ss in critical reading we enhance CT skills #eltchat
8:12 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: I think we might want to clarify what we mean - teahing CT or encouraging critical reading? Can we narrow down? #eltchat
8:12 pm olafelch: @Shaunwilden I agree 100%. Am often accused by teachers "They can't do that in German. How do you expect them to do it in English?" #ELTchat
8:12 pm OUPELTGlobal: Asking students questions, ones that don't have obvious right or wrong answers, is one good way to encourage critical thinking. #eltchat
8:13 pm CELT_Athens: @Shaunwilden Yes, absolutely, evaluation and supposition questions in the latter part #eltchat
8:13 pm hoprea: @esolcourses I feel that sometimes they lack the language to express it, but not the reasoning. #ELTChat
8:13 pm BethCagnol: RT @hoprea: RT @Marisa_C: I think we might want to clarify what we mean - teahing CT or encouraging critical reading? Can we narrow down? #ELTChat
8:13 pm ShellTerrell: @Marisa_C You make a good point! I encourage critical reading and that is different then showing Ss CT skills #ELTChat
8:13 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: One does not exclude the other so by engaging Ss in critical reading we enhance CT skills #eltchat
8:13 pm EveWeb: I think for reading it is quite important to develop CT, otherwise there is no guarantee of a real comprehension #ELTChat
8:13 pm Marisa_C: @Shaunwilden sorry tweetdeck mixing up my account with school #eltchat now i'm me now i'm celt
8:13 pm cybraryman1: RT @ShellTerrell: RT @Shaunwilden: Its very hard 4 sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when own ed systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:13 pm BloggersELT: @hoprea #eltchat I don't think it's easy to think critically in another lang. one is too busy trying to figure out the meaning of words
8:13 pm hoprea: RT @ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: One does not exclude the other so by engaging Ss in critical reading we enhance CT skills #ELTChat
8:14 pm Marisa_C: RT @CELT_Athens: @Shaunwilden Yes, absolutely, evaluation and supposition questions in the latter part #eltchat
8:14 pm BethCagnol: RT @Shaunwilden: Its very hard fotr sts to cope with CT when learning Eng when their own education systems dont encourage it #ELTchat:
8:14 pm Shaunwilden: @olafelch Yes I faced it in Czech, we used to laugh when asking sts what they think and basically be asked well what do YOU think? #ELTchat
8:14 pm EveWeb: I agree! RT @Marisa_C: One does not exclude the other so by engaging Ss in critical reading we enhance CT skills #eltchat
8:14 pm BloggersELT: Also, many English speaking people have difficulties thinking/reading critically! #ELTchat
8:15 pm Shaunwilden: RT @BloggersELT: Also, many English speaking people have difficulties thinking/reading critically! #ELTchat
8:15 pm ShellTerrell: @Marisa_C Yes, but 1 thing I learned fr CELTA is to point out when teaching Ss CT skills so they realize they are applying them #ELTChat
8:15 pm Marisa_C: @ShellTerrell I think no needs analysis of an ESP class would have this "Develop the Ss' CT skills" this an issue #eltchat
8:15 pm ShellTerrell: RT @BloggersELT: Also, many English speaking people have difficulties thinking/reading critically! #ELTchat
8:15 pm hoprea: @BloggersELT I see your point and I agree with you. But then isn't it the teacher's job to make understanding easier n foster disc. #ELTChat
8:15 pm olafelch: RT @BloggersELT: Also, many English speaking people have difficulties thinking/reading critically! #ELTchat
8:15 pm esolcourses: @hoprea @ShellTerrell many older learners do think critically, but IME not all do. Depends on individual rather than age, IMO #ELTchat
8:15 pm OUPELTGlobal: @Shaunwilden This is true, however by providing some models and a setting that encourages CT you might help get them there. #eltchat
8:15 pm Marisa_C: @ShellTerrell hmmm the metacognitive function already!!! :-D Yes! #ELTChat
8:16 pm hoprea: So we've got to first identify whether or not the learner is used to thinking critically in L1... #ELTChat
8:17 pm esolcourses: RT @BloggersELT many English speaking people have difficulties thinking/reading critically! #ELTchat ] yep! would go along with that
8:17 pm ShellTerrell: @olafelch Maybe we should define what we mean by developing CT skills? Is this implicit or explicit? #ELTChat
8:17 pm Shaunwilden: RT @OUPELTGlobal: by providing some models + a setting that encourages CT you might help get them there. #eltchat Yes I used to hope so :-)
8:17 pm BethCagnol: RT @olafelch: RT @BloggersELT: Also, many English speaking people have difficulties thinking/reading critically! #ELTchat
8:17 pm BloggersELT: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Asking students qu's, 1s that don't have obvious right or wrong ans, is 1good way to encourage critical thinking. #eltchat
8:17 pm Akevy613: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:17 pm OUPELTGlobal: @Marisa_C We're really using critical thinking as a tool that students can apply to any discipline or activity. #eltchat
8:17 pm olafelch: @OUPELTGlobal I'm sure you're right. How high would you place CT in the goals of a course? #eltchat
8:18 pm esolcourses: RT @hoprea So we've got to first identify whether or not the learner is used to thinking critically in L1... #ELTChat
8:18 pm ShellTerrell: @DaveDodgson Yes but if Ss use language don't they have to be able to CT in language quickly? This takes time to develop #ELTChat
8:18 pm Marisa_C: RT @ShellTerrell: @olafelch Maybe we should define what we mean by developing CT skills? Is this implicit or explicit? #ELTChat | Age of Ss?
8:18 pm haleysimons: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:18 pm Shaunwilden: RT @hoprea: So we've got to first identify whether or not the learner is used to thinking critically in L1... #ELTChat
8:18 pm EveWeb: Metacognition plays an important role in reading. We should teach SS how 2 see their own learning process, so they'll develop CP 2. #ELTChat
8:19 pm BloggersELT: What are some best practices to follow when developing critical thinking in materials or even better, without materials! #eltchat
8:19 pm hoprea: If we encourage students to go beyond T or F, or right and wrong, we allow for an urge to speak and communicate ideas. #ELTChat
8:19 pm Shaunwilden: @hoprea and with that ensure that new teachers to the culture are made aware of this #ELTchat
8:19 pm Marisa_C: RT @OUPELTGlobal: We're really using critical thinking as a tool that students can apply to any discipline or activity. #eltchat | Agree!
8:19 pm confessionality: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:19 pm ShellTerrell: In the US the ESL standards do include strands for developing CT Skills so sometimes this is required by program #ELTChat
8:20 pm ShellTerrell: RT @esolcourses: @hoprea @ShellTerrell many older learners do think critically, but IME not all do. Depends on individual rather than age, IMO #ELTchat
8:20 pm Marisa_C: RT @haleysimons: RT @personified CT highly important- nurtures areas of brain development, with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:20 pm olafelch: @ShellTerrell My feeling is that high level sts can demonstrate CT. Low level sts can't. It often comes down 2 language competence. #ELTChat
8:20 pm BethCagnol: RT @hoprea: So we've got to first identify whether or not the learner is used to thinking critically in L1... #ELTChat
8:20 pm EveWeb: That is something I have to deal with in my ESP courses. RT @hoprea So we've got to first identify whether or not the learner ... #ELTChat
8:20 pm web20education: Internet Safety Resources on Simplek12 #insafe #safedchat #educanattion #edtech20 #edtechbc#elearning #ELTChat... http://fb.me/xstBNlQT
8:20 pm ShellTerrell: @esolcourses @hoprea I think sometimes my learners get so involved in learning structure & form they forget the CT skills #ELTChat
8:20 pm Marisa_C: RT @EveWeb: Metacognition important in reading. We should teach SS how 2 see their own learning process, so they'll develop CP 2. #ELTChat
8:21 pm ShellTerrell: RT @olafelch: My feeling is that high level sts can demonstrate CT. Low level sts can't. It often comes down 2 language competence. #ELTChat
8:21 pm OUPELTGlobal: Research by the American Management Assoc.identified CT as the most important skill to have in the next 5 years #eltchat
8:21 pm hoprea: Lack of language competence to express ideas = lack of CT ?? I don't think so... #ELTChat
8:21 pm esolcourses: @bethcagnol @hoprea yes, I'd agree with all of that #ELTChat
8:21 pm Marisa_C: @confessionality Important point - the transfer, spill effect on other areas of learning highly important #ELTchat
8:21 pm ShellTerrell: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Research by the American Management Assoc.identified CT as the most important skill to have in the next 5 years #eltchat
8:21 pm Akevy613: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Research by the American Management Assoc.identified CT as the most important skill to have in the next 5 years #eltchat
8:22 pm esolcourses: RT @ShellTerrell: @esolcourses @hoprea I think sometimes my learners get so involved in learning structure & form they forget the CT skills #ELTChat
8:22 pm olafelch: @ShellTerrell I would say that it's implicitly included in the CEF too. (Not sure if it is cited directly) #ELTChat
8:22 pm DaveDodgson: @ShellTerrell @olafelch Surely there's a difference between possessing CT skills & demonstrating them #eltchat
8:22 pm CELT_Athens: RT @ShellTerrell: @hoprea I think sometimes my learners get so involved in learning structure & form they forget the CT skills #ELTChat
8:22 pm hoprea: @ShellTerrell I agree with you. Hence the need for us to let them work a bit longer so they can move beyond form. #ELTChat
8:22 pm esolcourses: RT @ShellTerrell: RT @olafelch: My feeling is that high level sts can demonstrate CT. Low level sts can't. It often comes down 2 language competence. #ELTChat
8:22 pm ShellTerrell: My courses at all levels and age groups includes CT skills so it also depends on the teacher & their methodology & training #ELTChat
8:23 pm BethCagnol: "Lack of language competence to express ideas = lack of CT ?? I don't think so..." #ELTChat OK I see your point.
8:23 pm naomi_moir: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Research by the American Management Assoc.identified CT as the most important skill to have in the next 5 years #eltchat
8:23 pm ShellTerrell: True! RT @DaveDodgson: Surely there's a difference between possessing CT skills & demonstrating them #eltchat
8:23 pm hoprea: @BethCagnol Agreed! What about leaving it for them to choose the texts? #ELTChat
8:23 pm Marisa_C: Learners quite often choose the 'play it safe' option in reception and production of language #eltchat
8:23 pm olafelch: @OUPELTGlobal The question is, is it what they need, what they want, or what they think they want? ;o) #eltchat
8:23 pm naomi_moir: RT @hoprea: Lack of language competence to express ideas = lack of CT ?? I don't think so... #ELTChat > good point!
8:23 pm BigDaddyVato: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:24 pm Shaunwilden: RT @olafelch: @OUPELTGlobal The question is, is it what they need, what they want, or what they think they want? ;o) #eltchat
8:24 pm hoprea: One way to work on critical thinking is bringing a text in the learners L1 and letting them talk about it in L2... #ELTChat
8:24 pm BloggersELT: @ShellTerrell @olafelch #eltchat more to do with students own education, life circumstances than lang. abilities
8:24 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: Learners quite often choose the 'play it safe' option in reception and production of language #eltchat
8:24 pm BethCagnol: @ShellTerrell @esolcourses @hoprea Also mine tend to rely too much on skimming and scanning. #eltchat
8:24 pm Marisa_C: But, is there any way of becoming a truly competent, advanced reader if one is not a critically competent reader? #ELTchat
8:24 pm BethCagnol: RT @hoprea: @BethCagnol Agreed! What about leaving it for them to choose the texts? #ELTChat
8:25 pm cybraryman1: My Questioning Techniques page which ties in with CT http://bit.ly/boU0XV #ELTchat
8:25 pm olafelch: @DaveDodgson That's exactly my point. Low level learners can't express it even if they have it. CT becomes a function of language. #eltchat
8:25 pm ShellTerrell: @hoprea My Ss are perfectionists. Maybe a culture thing so I have to constantly push them to move away fr the form #ELTChat
8:25 pm BloggersELT: RT @ShellTerrell: True! RT @DaveDodgson: Surely there's a difference between possessing CT skills & demonstrating them #eltchat
8:25 pm EveWeb: Definitively! RT @olafelch: My feeling is that high level sts can demonstrate CT. Low level sts can't. #ELTChat
8:25 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: But, is there any way of becoming a truly competent, advanced reader if one is not a critically competent reader? #ELTchat
8:25 pm hoprea: @Marisa_C That's a tough one, Marisa! Reading is more than understanding the words... #ELTChat
8:25 pm ShellTerrell: RT @hoprea: One way to work on critical thinking is bringing a text in the learners L1 and letting them talk about it in L2... #ELTChat
8:25 pm mikecrain: RT @personified: Critical thinking is highly important because it nurtures areas of brain development, along with creating engagement. #ELTchat
8:25 pm Akevy613: @ShellTerrell I have been watching this chat but I agree 100% C.T. is an important skill that needs2b taught&modeled in every grade #eltchat
8:26 pm BethCagnol: @ShellTerrell @esolcourses @hoprea Re: skimming. In France, they are trained to interpret, but not really get the juice out #eltchat
8:26 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: is there any way of becoming truly competent, advanced reader if one is not a critically competent reader? #ELTchat gd point
8:26 pm vickyloras: RT @cybraryman1 My Questioning Techniques page which ties in with CT http://bit.ly/boU0XV#ELTchat
8:26 pm ShellTerrell: @bethcagnol @esolcourses @hoprea I have the opposite problem where I have to keep time so they skim & scan #ELTChat
8:27 pm olafelch: This all seems to hark back to Gardner's multiple intelligences - word clever learners make the best impression #ELTchat
8:27 pm esolcourses: @hoprea can see that working if s's all have same L1... in may classroom situations that isn't going to be the case though #ELTChat
8:27 pm Marisa_C: So CT being a higher order skill it is something to introduce in gradual ways from early levels? Comments? #eltchat
8:27 pm ShellTerrell: RT @vickyloras: RT @cybraryman1 My Questioning Techniques page which ties in with CThttp://bit.ly/boU0XV #ELTchat
8:27 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Akevy613: I agree 100% C.T. is an important skill that needs2b taught&modeled in every grade #eltchat
8:28 pm olafelch: @hoprea No it's definitely not necessarily a lack of CT, but if they can't express it, how do we know it's there? #ELTChat
8:28 pm ShellTerrell: Yes, I agree RT @BloggersELT: #eltchat more to do with students own education, life circumstances than lang. abilities
8:28 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: So CT being a higher order skill it is something to introduce in gradual ways from early levels? Comments? #eltchat
8:28 pm personified: However, this isn't always the case... think: media influence. RT @ShellTerrell @hoprea agree, most older learners think critically #eltchat
8:28 pm hoprea: @personified My bad! Thanks for bringing it up. Perhaps I should have said "Shouldn't" and not "Don't"... #ELTChat
8:28 pm markbrumley: RT @olafelch: This all seems to hark back to Gardner's multiple intelligences - word clever learners make the best impression #ELTchat
8:28 pm EveWeb: I also think understanding a text doesn't mean SS know what to do with the info read. S/he must know what do to after, that is CT #ELTChat
8:28 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: So CT being a higher order skill it is sth to introduce in gradual ways from early levels? Comments? #eltchat I'd say so
8:29 pm OUPELTGlobal: Another advantage of CT is that - with our limited time to teach - we give Ss tools to learn things on their own #eltchat
8:29 pm olafelch: @Marisa_C That sounds very reasonable! ;o) #eltchat
8:29 pm Marisa_C: Can we perhaps move to types of TEXT and types of ACTIVITY which you have found useful in engaging Ss at CT level? #eltchat
8:29 pm DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C I think so. I encourage my learners (aged 8-10) to reflect on what they learned, how, why they liked it or not #eltchat
8:29 pm ShellTerrell: RT @EveWeb: I also think understanding a text doesn't mean SS know what to do with the info read. S/he must know what do to after, that is CT #ELTChat
8:29 pm personified: ! RT @OUPELTGlobal: Asking students questions, ones that don't have obvious right or wrong answers, is one good way to encourage CT #eltchat
8:29 pm hoprea: @olafelch Hmm... when you see their frustrated faces cuz they couldn't say what they wanted and ask to resort to L1. :) #ELTChat
8:29 pm BethCagnol: RT @Marisa_C: So CT being a higher order skill it is something to introduce in gradual ways from early levels? Comments? #eltchat
8:29 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: Can we perhaps move to types of TEXT and types of ACTIVITY which you have found useful in engaging Ss at CT level? #eltchat
8:29 pm Akevy613: RT @personified: ! RT @OUPELTGlobal: Asking students questions, ones that don't have obvious right or wrong answers, is one good way to encourage CT #eltchat
8:29 pm BloggersELT: @olafelch you're suggesting that complex "ideas" can only be expressed in complex structures and lexis? not so sure about that :) #ELTchat
8:30 pm ShellTerrell: @EveWeb Good point especially when teaching Business Eng & ESP courses the learner has to know how to apply to field #ELTChat
8:30 pm Marisa_C: For me, literary text is a typical genre which can encourage CT #eltchat
8:30 pm ShellTerrell: RT @personified: ! RT @OUPELTGlobal: Asking students questions, ones that don't have obvious right or wrong answers, is one good way to encourage CT #eltchat
8:30 pm Marisa_C: RT @DaveDodgson: I think so. I encourage my learners (aged 8-10) to reflect on what they learned, how, why they liked it or not #eltchat
8:31 pm DaveDodgson: @olafelch I've observed some kids finish a text, go back and re-read it, check meaning, query content etc. Evidence of CT? #eltchat
8:31 pm esolcourses: RT @Marisa_C: Can we perhaps move to types of TEXT and types of ACTIVITY which you have found useful in engaging Ss at CT level? #eltchat
8:31 pm Shaunwilden: I get the sts 2 underline lines of reasoning / argument in text - this helps both reading + writing as it shows text organisation #ELTchat
8:31 pm hoprea: We've got to find out what makes them tick if we expect them to be engaged so as to think about their answers. #ELTChat
8:31 pm BethCagnol: @Marisa_C #ELTchat 1 example is today: I gave my students a text to prepare a debate next week. They will really have to pick it apart.
8:31 pm ShellTerrell: Debates! It helps when I have my Ss Skype another class from other side of world who thinks differently about an issue #ELTChat
8:32 pm ShellTerrell: @bethcagnol We both thought about debates :-) #ELTChat
8:32 pm DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C I believe this helps lay foundation for higher level CT as they get older #eltchat
8:32 pm olafelch: @hoprea Sure (though not in a mixed L1 class), but that's why I wonder if good receptive + productive skill should come 1st. #ELTChat
8:32 pm ShellTerrell: RT @hoprea: We've got to find out what makes them tick if we expect them to be engaged so as to think about their answers. #ELTChat
8:32 pm Marisa_C: @ShellTerrell Yes - open ended and open to interpretation rather than closed type questions #eltchat
8:33 pm Akevy613: @personified Any type of open ended question or project helps encourages C.T. Stud tend2 enjoy them&therefore they r more engaged #eltchat
8:33 pm Marisa_C: RT @Shaunwilden: I get the sts 2 underline lines of reasoning in text helps both reading + writing as it shows text organisation #ELTchat
8:33 pm hoprea: One thing they've got to develop also is tolerance and respect for different opinions. #ELTChat
8:33 pm kalinagoenglish: @Marisa_C some examples... google public data explorer: http://ow.ly/2LWgd / cross culture guides: http://ow.ly/2LWhm #ELTchat
8:33 pm naomi_moir: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Another advantage of CT - with limited time to teach - we give Ss tools to learn things on their own #eltchat > like it!
8:33 pm olafelch: @DaveDodgson Could be, but could just be a solid work method. (I would love to see that in the majority of my kids!) #eltchat
8:33 pm EveWeb: I've being using wikis 2 create text typology e-portfolios to encourage my SS 2 read, learn on genre & use CT. http://bit.ly/dmg9OW #ELTChat
8:33 pm esolcourses: @Marisa_C @bethcagnol @ShellTerrell debates, (especially topical issues) & presentations are good activities to encourage CT #eltchat
8:33 pm web20education: New VIRTUAL FORUM 2010 #educanattion #edtech20 #edtechbc #elearning #ELTChat#plenk10 #P21cs... http://fb.me/Jx9sTXKr
8:34 pm BethCagnol: @ShellTerrell: @bethcagnol We both thought about debates :-) #ELTChat >> JINX!!!! LOL
8:34 pm Shaunwilden: RT @DaveDodgson: I encge my learners to reflect on what they learned, how, y they liked #eltchat - go idea I do that with adults as well
8:34 pm naomi_moir: RT @naomi_moir: @Marisa_C yes, can't leap in deep end, esp if sts aren't used to doing or still learning skills in L1 (e.g. YLs) #eltchat
8:34 pm Marisa_C: @hoprea Agree - critical does not mean intolerant! #ELTChat
8:34 pm ShellTerrell: Preparing presentations where they argue a point & try to persuade others (Pecha Kuchas good for this) #ELTChat
8:34 pm ShellTerrell: RT @EveWeb: I've being using wikis 2 create text typology e-portfolios to encourage my SS 2 read, learn on genre & use CT. http://bit.ly/dmg9OW #ELTChat
8:34 pm ShellTerrell: RT @kalinagoenglish: @Marisa_C some examples... google public data explorer:http://ow.ly/2LWgd / cross culture guides: http://ow.ly/2LWhm #ELTchat
8:34 pm ShellTerrell: RT @hoprea: One thing they've got to develop also is tolerance and respect for different opinions. #ELTChat
8:35 pm personified: Think about CT skills in context to learning styles. Diff. styles = diff. abilities. For some CT is implicit, for others, not. #ELTChat
8:35 pm Shaunwilden: RT @hoprea: One thing they've got to develop also is tolerance and respect for different opinions. #ELTChat
8:35 pm ShellTerrell: RT @esolcourses: @Marisa_C @bethcagnol @ShellTerrell debates, (especially topical issues) & presentations are good activities to encourage CT #eltchat
8:35 pm olafelch: @BloggersELT It's certainly easier, but reducing complex ideas to simple language is also a highly prized skill. #ELTchat
8:35 pm ELTExperiences: Good night all. I hope you had a #WonderfulWednesday. See you all tomorrow. Enjoy the #ELTchat.
8:35 pm BethCagnol: #ELTchat I think if the text is a part of a whole (e.g. Lesson plan with a distinct goal) then that works better.
8:35 pm Marisa_C: RT @Shaunwilden: RT @DaveDodgson: I encge my learners to reflect on what they learned, how, y they liked #eltchat - go idea with adults 2
8:35 pm esolcourses: RT @Shaunwilden RT @DaveDodgson: I encge my learners to reflect on what they learned, how, y they liked #eltchat - same here
8:36 pm calliopeconsult: RT @kalinagoenglish: @Marisa_C some examples... google public data explorer:http://ow.ly/2LWgd / cross culture guides: http://ow.ly/2LWhm #ELTchat
8:36 pm hoprea: We've spent so much time focussing on getting them to remember only, that it's now complicated to get them to understanding... #ELTChat
8:36 pm EveWeb: We have discussions in class about their texts while developing the e-portfolios #ELTChat
8:36 pm naomi_moir: RT @DaveDodgson: I encourage my learners (aged 8-10) 2reflect on what they learned, how, why they liked or not #eltchat > great way 2 start
8:36 pm olafelch: RT @DaveDodgson: I encge my learners to reflect on what they learned, how, y they liked #eltchat - go idea I do that with adults as well
8:36 pm DaveDodgson: @olafelch I'd love to see it in all my kids too! Still too many who just finish an exercise and close the book! #eltchat
8:36 pm ShellTerrell: Case studies, TED Talks can be used to help promote CT Skills #Eltchat
8:36 pm Marisa_C: @kalinagoenglish Encouraging reading with an attitude or discovering attitude in text? #eltchat
8:37 pm DaveDodgson: @olafelch ...but it all comes gradually and at different rates in different learners. #eltchat
8:37 pm Marisa_C: Asking Ss to read with a specific attitude or adopted bias is an interesting exercise #eltchat
8:37 pm kalinagoenglish: @Marisa_C both! Either they come in with their own opinions or we get them reading opinions and providing their own #ELTchat
8:37 pm BethCagnol: @hoprea #eltchat And we have to admit we ask a lot of our students in the language classroom.
8:37 pm hoprea: RT @ShellTerrell: Case studies, TED Talks can be used to help promote CT Skills #ELTChat
8:37 pm ShellTerrell: I have had my teen ELLs critically analyze US commercials then recreate commercial after fixing stereotypes, etc. They love this! #ELTChat
8:37 pm BloggersELT: @Marisa_C more examples (faves) freedom & firestorms http://ow.ly/2LWqF not publishable due to... http://ow.ly/2LWqG #ELTchat
8:38 pm Marisa_C: @kalinagoenglish Agree! #ELTchat
8:38 pm Shaunwilden: If using e.g. an article finding it from different sources helps highlight different attitudes, show bias etc #ELTchat
8:38 pm hoprea: RT @Marisa_C: Asking Ss to read with a specific attitude or adopted bias is an interesting exercise <- And it usually works! :) #ELTChat
8:38 pm olafelch: @DaveDodgson I REALLY hate that - I even tried introducing a penalty if I saw that going on. It didn't work. ;o( #eltchat
8:38 pm personified: agrees. Depends on learning style/ abilities. RT @hoprea: Lack of lang competence to express ideas = lack of CT ?? I don't think so.#ELTChat
8:38 pm Marisa_C: RT @kalinagoenglish: both! Either they come in with their own opinions or we get them reading opinions and providing their own #ELTchat
8:38 pm DaveDodgson: RT @Marisa_C: Asking Ss to read with a specific attitude or adopted bias is an interesting exercise #eltchat
8:38 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: Asking Ss to read with a specific attitude or adopted bias is an interesting exercise #eltchat
8:39 pm Marisa_C: RT @ShellTerrell: I have had my teen ELLs critically analyze US commercials then recreate after fixing stereotypes They love this! #ELTChat
8:39 pm esolcourses: RT @Shaunwilden: If using e.g. an article finding it from different sources helps highlight different attitudes, show bias etc #ELTchat
8:39 pm BethCagnol: @ShellTerrell #eltchat. I think you've hit the nail on the head. You've achieved the "appeal factor" in your CT classroom.
8:39 pm BloggersELT: I wish I would stop forgetting to use the hashtag #ELTchat :-)))
8:39 pm kalinagoenglish: I wish I would stop forgetting to use the hashtag #ELTchat :-)))
8:39 pm hoprea: RT @BethCagnol: @hoprea And we have to admit we ask a lot of our students in the language classroom. <- True! #ELTChat
8:39 pm esolcourses: RT @ShellTerrell: I have had my teen ELLs critically analyze US commercials then recreate commercial after fixing stereotypes, etc. They love this! #ELTChat
8:39 pm Marisa_C: Also asking them to read in role #eltchat - has anyone tried this?
8:40 pm Marisa_C: RT @Shaunwilden: If using e.g. an article finding it from different sources helps highlight different attitudes, show bias #ELTchat Yes!
8:40 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: Also asking them to read in role #eltchat - has anyone tried this? No can you expand on how and why?
8:40 pm hoprea: @kalinagoenglish Join the dark side of Tweetgrid or tweetchat! :) #ELTChat
8:40 pm DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C Asking them to debate a topic from the opposite point of viewto their own works well too #eltchat
8:40 pm BloggersELT: @olafelch again, not sure :-) sometimes when I've been in L2 situations of difficulty... I've somehow made my "need" known #ELTchat
8:40 pm olafelch: A big issue in Germany is that the whole system is focused on the next test - not in the next test the kids don't want to know. #ELTchat
8:40 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: Also asking them to read in role #eltchat - has anyone tried this?
8:41 pm BethCagnol: @Marisa_C #eltchat Sorry, "read in role?" do you mean "acting?"
8:41 pm personified: RT @hoprea: One way to work on critical thinking is bringing a text in the learners L1 and letting them talk about it in L2... #ELTChat
8:41 pm EveWeb: It is a gradual process. My SS don't know how 2 read at the beginning, but at the end of th school year, they do effectively #ELTChat
8:41 pm Marisa_C: @Shaunwilden Reading in role - e.g. how would a lawyer, a psychologist etc interpret this - how would they react? #eltchat
8:41 pm hoprea: @personified I guess it's a bit of both. However, a discussion can't be simply another chance to work on form. #ELTChat
8:41 pm BethCagnol: @DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C Asking them to debate a topic from the opposite point of viewto their own works well too #eltchat Totally agree 100%
8:42 pm OUPELTGlobal: Is anyone familiar with understanding by design McTighe and Wiggins? #eltchat
8:42 pm olafelch: @BloggersELT I agree completely that this is possible, but it's much harder with 20 kids in a class. #ELTchat
8:42 pm hoprea: @Marisa_C This might be quite complicated for some learners / some cultural backgrounds. But I'd give it a try. #ELTChat
8:42 pm Marisa_C: @olafelch Not only in Germany I fear dear elch! #ELTchat In Greece too! Teacher is mainly a language dispenser & exam trainer!!!!
8:42 pm BethCagnol: @Marisa_C: @Shaunwilden Reading in role - how would a lawyer, a psychologist etc interpret this - how would they react? #eltchat gr8 idea!
8:42 pm personified: Debates foster CT skills. #ELTChat
8:43 pm ShellTerrell: For YL recreating a story from point-of-view of the villain! @Marisa_C has a good lesson for this #ELTChat
8:43 pm EveWeb: I agree. Background knowledge is also important. RT @hoprea: One way to work on CT is bringing a text in the learners L1 ..in L2... #ELTChat
8:43 pm Shaunwilden: If dealing with lexis ask sts to categorise how they want as long as they can jusitfy why helps, very Gardneresque #eltchat
8:43 pm Marisa_C: RT @bethcagnol: @DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C Asking them to debate a topic from the opposite point of viewto #eltchat Totally agree 100% YES!
8:43 pm personified: debates! RT @hoprea: One thing they've got to develop also is tolerance and respect for different opinions. #ELTChat
8:43 pm hoprea: RT @personified: Debates foster CT skills. <- if properly conducted by the teacher. :) #ELTChat
8:43 pm ShellTerrell: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Is anyone familiar with understanding by design McTighe and Wiggins? #eltchat
8:43 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: Reading in role e.g. how would lawyer, a psychologist etc interpret this - how would they react? #eltchat Oh thats a gd idea
8:43 pm Marisa_C: RT @personified: Debates foster CT skills. #ELTChat Absolutely! Taking sides also engages at a personal level
8:43 pm DaveDodgson: RT @ShellTerrell: For YL recreating a story from point-of-view of the villain! @Marisa_C has a good lesson for this #ELTChat
8:43 pm CELT_Athens: RT @ShellTerrell: For YL recreating a story from point-of-view of the villain! @Marisa_C has a good lesson for this #ELTChat
8:43 pm ColinTGraham: Japan too! RT @Marisa_C: Not only in Germany I fear dear elch! #ELTchat In Greece too! Teacher is a language dispenser & exam trainer!
8:44 pm olafelch: @Marisa_C It's a major hindrance to skills training. We often lurch from one crisis to the next. #ELTchat
8:44 pm Marisa_C: RT @ShellTerrell: For YL recreating a story from point-of-view of the villain! @Marisa_C has a good lesson for this #ELTChat I do?
8:44 pm EveWeb: I love this @Marisa_C. Asking them to debate a topic from the opposite point of view to #eltchat
8:44 pm OUPELTGlobal: Encouraging students to read two separate viewpoints on a single topic and then compare them can help refine CT #eltchat
8:44 pm olafelch: RT @Marisa_C: RT @personified: Debates foster CT skills. #ELTChat Absolutely! Taking sides also engages at a personal level
8:45 pm BethCagnol: @Marisa_C: @Shaunwilden I've done this w/ 1 text ab a scandal. I got sts to respond as the lawyer, doc. mother, etc. #eltchat gr8 idea!?
8:45 pm esolcourses: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Encouraging students to read two separate viewpoints on a single topic and then compare them can help refine CT #eltchat
8:45 pm Marisa_C: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Encouraging students to read two separate viewpoints on a single topic and then compare them can help refine CT #eltchat
8:45 pm hoprea: But what would the most important be if you HAD TO choose? Language skills or Critical Thinking? #ELTChat
8:45 pm BloggersELT: @hoprea absolutely (re foster discussions) #ELTchat
8:45 pm DaveDodgson: @ShellTerrell Or the villan's mother! She has to say nice things, right? ;) #eltchat
8:45 pm OUPELTGlobal: RT @personified: debates! RT @hoprea: One thing they've got to develop also is tolerance and respect for different opinions. #ELTChat
8:45 pm esolcourses: RT @Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: Reading in role e.g. how would lawyer, a psychologist etc interpret this - how would they react? #eltchat Oh thats a gd idea
8:46 pm SimonGreenall: Sorry to be late Has anyone mentioned Stella Cottrell Critical Thinking skillshttp://bit.ly/diXFkW ? #ELTchat
8:46 pm Marisa_C: @hoprea In aproblem solving oriented approach to teaching, focused on discovery learning there is no issue of choice I think #ELTChat
8:46 pm ShellTerrell: @Marisa_C You're little Red Riding Hood! It retells a different way & also that 1 about kids burying the sis #ELTChat
8:46 pm ShellTerrell: Love this! RT @DaveDodgson: Or the villan's mother! She has to say nice things, right? ;) #eltchat
8:46 pm naomi_moir: RT @hoprea: But what would the most important be if you HAD TO choose? Language skills or Critical Thinking? #ELTChat
8:46 pm ColinTGraham: I've found with adult students that getting them to follow a news story (of their own choice) and then 'presenting' it works well #ELTchat
8:46 pm DaveDodgson: RT @ColinTGraham: Japan too! RT @Marisa_C: Not only in Germany I fear dear elch! #ELTchat In Greece too! <---Add Turkey to the list!
8:46 pm olafelch: @hoprea In a school situation, and in some Business situations too, I would choose language skills. #ELTChat
8:46 pm ShellTerrell: @DaveDodgson I'm so using that this year! #ELTChat
8:46 pm EveWeb: I think they go together while SS learn language use. RT @hoprea: But what would the most important be if you HAD TO choose? #ELTChat
8:46 pm Marisa_C: RT @bethcagnol: I've done this w/ 1 text ab a scandal. I got sts to respond as the lawyer, doc. mother, etc. #eltchat gr8 idea!? Fab!
8:47 pm DaveDodgson: RT @hoprea: But what would the most important be if you HAD TO choose? Language skills or Critical Thinking? #ELTChat
8:47 pm hoprea: @Marisa_C I agree with you. But that's not always the case, unfortunately. #ELTChat
8:47 pm BethCagnol: #eltchat This isn't the text I use, but it's the story. Great for debating: http://tiny.cc/r14a8
8:47 pm DaveDodgson: @hoprea And what would be most important to Ss if they had to choose? #eltchat
8:47 pm Marisa_C: @ShellTerrell oops yes , forgot about those!!! #ELTChat
8:47 pm naomi_moir: RT @ColinTGraham: I've found getting sts to follow a news story (own choice) and then 'presenting' it works well #ELTchat . nice idea
8:47 pm hoprea: @olafelch That's exactly what I had in mind. 140 characters weren't enough to make my thoughts clear. :) #ELTChat
8:47 pm Shaunwilden: RT @SimonGreenall: Has anyone mentioned Stella Cottrell CT skills http://bit.ly/diXFkW#ELTchat super book, loads of gd ideas and activities
8:48 pm Marisa_C: RT @SimonGreenall: Sorry to be late Has anyone mentioned Stella Cottrell Critical Thinking skills http://bit.ly/diXFkW ? #ELTchat Now I have
8:48 pm BloggersELT: @naomi_moir @hoprea @olafelch I don't understand why there needs to be a choice.. what "R" language skills anyway? #ELTchat
8:48 pm EveWeb: I guess language skills, not thinking LOL. RT @DaveDodgson: @hoprea And what would be most important to Ss if they had to choose? #eltchat
8:48 pm ShellTerrell: For YL they get an object & have to imagine its something else w/ a partner. It's impromptu so they play off each other #ELTChat
8:48 pm OUPELTGlobal: @personified You make a good pt, it is an important skill to develop. Exposure to topics with no wright or wrong answer with class #eltchat
8:48 pm hoprea: I'm afraid some students will actually believe they only need to focus on form if teachers don't show them otherwise. #ELTChat
8:48 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Shaunwilden: RT @SimonGreenall: Has anyone mentioned Stella Cottrell CT skillshttp://bit.ly/diXFkW #ELTchat super book, loads of gd ideas and activities
8:48 pm BethCagnol: #ELTchat I also sometimes get students to tell me the point of view of someone who isn't mentioned in the text.
8:49 pm DaveDodgson: @ShellTerrell It's a good one - the girls in your class will love it! (boys can always role play the villan crying to mummy) #eltchat
8:49 pm ShellTerrell: RT @hoprea: I'm afraid some students will actually believe they only need to focus on form if teachers don't show them otherwise. #ELTChat
8:49 pm personified: RT @hoprea: But what would the most important be if you HAD TO choose? Language skills or Critical Thinking? #ELTChat
8:49 pm olafelch: @hoprea First and foremost, I'm a language teacher. There are lots of other things that are "nice to have" but they come second. #ELTChat
8:49 pm ShellTerrell: @DaveDodgson Love that too! They'd love to be the villains! #eltchat
8:49 pm EveWeb: Agree. RT @hoprea: I'm afraid some SS will actually believe they only need to focus on form if teachers don't show them otherwise. #ELTChat
8:49 pm BloggersELT: RT @hoprea: I'm afraid some students will actually believe they only need to focus on form if teachers don't show them otherwise. #ELTChat
8:49 pm ShellTerrell: RT @BethCagnol: #ELTchat I also sometimes get students to tell me the point of view of someone who isn't mentioned in the text.
8:50 pm ColinTGraham: With free choice of a news item, Ss can question why the choice was made, sources of info, and often have their own opinions too #ELTchat
8:50 pm Marisa_C: @SimonGreenall CT for Chinese at discourse & political level? Tricky if all they want to do is memorise! #eltchat
8:50 pm DaveDodgson: @EveWeb @hoprea So, we have to slip in CT skills, reflective learning etc when they are 'not looking' so to speak #eltchat
8:50 pm hoprea: Gee, it's just too hard being a teacher. We work as teachers, psychologists, parents, encouragers... but only get one paycheck! :) #ELTChat
8:50 pm Marisa_C: RT @ShellTerrell: RT @BethCagnol: #ELTchat I sometimes get students to tell me the point of view of someone who isn't mentioned in the text
8:50 pm BethCagnol: RT @hoprea: Gee, it's just too hard being a teacher. We work as teachers, psychologists, parents, encouragers... but only get one paycheck! :) #ELTChat
8:51 pm Shaunwilden: I always use bit of python in CT workshops / session - a bit of humour always helps :-)http://bit.ly/dvtBYq #ELTChat
8:51 pm hoprea: RT @olafelch: @hoprea First and foremost, I'm a language teacher. There r lots of other things "nice to have" but they come second. #ELTChat
8:51 pm SimonGreenall: RT @Marisa_C: CT for Chinese at discourse & political level? Tricky if all they want to do is memorise! #eltchat> No, its different now.
8:51 pm ShellTerrell: This story Wolf's Point of View very good for YL & considering different point of viewshttp://bit.ly/9GQKsQ #ELTChat
8:51 pm ColinTGraham: Dilemma problems can be good too, where there are three or four characters and it is not clear who is 'right' in a given situation #ELTchat
8:51 pm personified: Language skills and Critical thinking cannot be separated. Language must be contextual if they are to create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:51 pm hoprea: @DaveDodgson In some cases, unfortunately that's the case. :) #ELTChat
8:51 pm OUPELTGlobal: We try to think of critical thinking as a tool to engage the learner. Once they are engaged they'll learn the language #eltchat
8:51 pm Marisa_C: @ShellTerrell Roal Dahl has a great version of LRRH from the point of view of the wolf - it was a set up! Nice for a TBL lesson! #eltchat
8:51 pm ShellTerrell: RT @ColinTGraham: With free choice of a news item, Ss can question why the choice was made, sources of info, and often have their own opinions too #ELTchat
8:52 pm Shaunwilden: RT @hoprea: Gee, it's just too hard being a teacher. We work as teachers, psychologists, parents, encouragers... but only get one paycheck! :) #ELTChat
8:52 pm esolcourses: @hoprea @olafelch I think in some situations, i.e. working 2 a narrow syllabus & tight schedule, it can be hard to work CT into mix #ELTChat
8:52 pm BloggersELT: RT @BethCagnol: #ELTchat I also sometimes get students to tell me the point of view of someone who isn't mentioned in the text. Super tip!
8:52 pm personified: RT @hoprea: I'm afraid some students will actually believe they only need to focus on form if teachers don't show them otherwise. #ELTChat
8:52 pm Shaunwilden: RT @OUPELTGlobal: We try to think of critical thinking as a tool to engage the learner. Once they are engaged they'll learn the language #eltchat
8:52 pm damana: RT @personified: Language skills and Critical thinking cannot be separated. Language must be contextual if they are to create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:52 pm CELT_Athens: RT @Shaunwilden: I always use bit of python in CT workshops / session - a bit of humour always helps :-) http://bit.ly/dvtBYq #ELTChat
8:52 pm hoprea: @Shaunwilden Laughter lubricates learning. :) #ELTChat
8:52 pm olafelch: @BloggersELT Form isn't everything by a long way, but many employers and those in FE think it is. I have to serve my students. #ELTchat
8:52 pm ShellTerrell: RT @OUPELTGlobal: We try to think of critical thinking as a tool to engage the learner. Once they are engaged they'll learn the language #eltchat
8:52 pm EveWeb: Definitively. @DaveDodgson @hoprea So, we have to slip in CT skills, reflective learning when they are 'not looking' so 2 speak #eltchat
8:52 pm Shaunwilden: RT @personified: Language skills and Critical thinking cannot be separated. Language must be contextual if they are to create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:52 pm BethCagnol: RT @ShellTerrell Story Wolf's Point of View very good for YL & considering different point of views http://bit.ly/9GQKsQ #ELTChat BRILL!
8:52 pm BloggersELT: RT @OUPELTGlobal: We try to think of critical thinking as a tool to engage the lr. Once they are engaged they'll learn the language #eltchat
8:53 pm BigDaddyVato: RT @personified: Language skills and Critical thinking cannot be separated. Language must be contextual if they are to create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:53 pm olafelch: @esolcourses I agree. Ideally it would be there, but there are other major influences. #ELTChat
8:53 pm ShellTerrell: RT @personified: Language skills and Critical thinking cannot be separated. Language must be contextual if they are to create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:53 pm naomi_moir: @BloggersELT Indeed ,not nec 2 separate - much of what is done in current (YL) teaching includes development of CT & social skills #eltchat
8:53 pm kalinagoenglish: RT @personified: Lang skills +CT cannot be separated. Language must be contextual if they r to create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:53 pm Marisa_C: @ShellTerrell @DaveDodgson #ELTchat Your idea works really well for identifying attitude, bias & so on - also cultural aspects of text
8:53 pm ColinTGraham: We also have to consider the cultural considerations of teaching CT where such things may be 'frowned' on EFL vs ESL #ELTchat
8:53 pm DaveDodgson: @OUPELTGlobal Yes - Developing critical thinking skills should aim to make them more effective independent learners. #eltchat
8:54 pm personified: RT @OUPELTGlobal: We try to think of CT as a tool to engage the learner. Once they are engaged they'll learn the language #eltchat
8:54 pm EveWeb: RT @personified: Language skills and CT cannot be separated. Language must b contextual if they are 2 create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:54 pm Marisa_C: @bethcagnol Support the underwolf!!! :-D #ELTchat
8:54 pm Marisa_C: RT @DaveDodgson: @OUPELTGlobal Developing critical thinking skills should aim to make them more effective independent learners. #eltchat
8:54 pm MARIELBACHIRINO: RT @esolcourses: RT @DaveDodgson: It's important for developing reflective skills e.g self-assessment #eltchat
8:55 pm hoprea: There are different layers in critical thinking. How deep should we expect our learners to go in a language classroom? #ELTChat
8:55 pm Marisa_C: @SimonGreenall Happy to hear that - my recollections are of a different time I guess #eltchat
8:55 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: RT @DaveDodgson: @OUPELTGlobal Developing critical thinking skills should aim to make them more effective independent learners. #eltchat
8:55 pm DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C @ShellTerrell I'll be doing it with the Wicked Witches from Wizard of Oz soon! #eltchat
8:55 pm Marisa_C: RT @MARIELBACHIRINO: RT @esolcourses: RT @DaveDodgson: It's important for developing reflective skills e.g self-assessment #eltchat
8:55 pm BethCagnol: RT @hoprea: There are different layers in critical thinking. How deep should we expect our learners to go in a language classroom? #ELTChat
8:55 pm Marisa_C: RT @ShellTerrell: Love this! RT @DaveDodgson: Or the villan's mother! She has to say nice things, right? ;) #eltchat
8:55 pm hoprea: IMO, it's much more important that they can support a point of view regardless of it being their own. #ELTChat
8:55 pm OUPELTGlobal: RT @EveWeb: RT @personified: Language skills and CT cannot be separated. Language must b contextual if they are 2 create meaningful connections #ELTChat
8:56 pm ShellTerrell: Brilliant! #ELTChat RT @bethcagnol: @Marisa_C @shellterrell Then get one student to play the Wolf's lawyer. :-)
8:56 pm esolcourses: RT @hoprea: There are different layers in critical thinking. How deep should we expect our learners to go in a language classroom? #ELTChat
8:56 pm olafelch: @kalinagoenglish I know what you mean. In this case I take CT to mean creative use of understanding rather than just understanding. #ELTchat
8:56 pm BloggersELT: BRAVO!!! @Marisa_C: RT @DaveDodgson: @OUPELTGlobal Developing CT skills should aim to make ss more effective independent learners. #eltchat
8:56 pm BethCagnol: @hoprea How deep should we expect our learners to go" We could look at Jamie Keddie as a good example
Of dev CT skills with videos. #ELTChat
8:56 pm Marisa_C: RT @DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C @ShellTerrell I'll be doing it with the Wicked Witches from Wizard of Oz soon! #eltchat
8:57 pm ShellTerrell: RT @hoprea: There are different layers in critical thinking. How deep should we expect our learners to go in a language classroom? #ELTChat
8:57 pm olafelch: RT @hoprea: IMO, it's much more important that they can support a point of view regardless of it being their own. #ELTChat (Great point!)
8:57 pm Marisa_C: So it looks like it's possible to cultivate CT even with younger classes if ony we find appropriate materials! #ELTchat AND activities
8:57 pm SimonGreenall: RT @Marisa_C: @SimonGreenall Happy to hear that - my recollections are of a different time I guess #eltchat >Part of the curriculum now.
8:58 pm kalinagoenglish: @olafelch :-)) #ELTchat
8:58 pm Marisa_C: RT @hoprea: IMO, it's much more important that they can support a point of view regardless of it being their own. #ELTChat YES!
8:58 pm EveWeb: It will depend on their language skills and age. RT @hoprea: There are different layers in CT. How deep should we ...? #ELTChat
8:58 pm DaveDodgson: @Marisa_C and allow a few minutes for reflection at the end of class #eltchat
8:58 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Marisa_C: So it looks like it's possible to cultivate CT even with younger classes if ony we find appropriate materials! #ELTchat AND activities
8:58 pm DaveDodgson: RT @Marisa_C: So it looks like it's possible to cultivate CT even with younger classes if ony we find appropriate materials! #ELTchat AND activities
8:58 pm ShellTerrell: RT @BethCagnol: @hoprea How deep should we expect our learners to go" We could look at Jamie Keddie as a good example
Of dev CT skills with videos. #ELTChat
8:59 pm olafelch: @Marisa_C I think "cultivate" is an excellent choice of word. #ELTchat
8:59 pm EveWeb: And course objectives, of course. RT @hoprea: There are different layers in CT. How deep should we ...? #ELTChat
8:59 pm personified: @hoprea There's not set agenda for the density that we should develop a skill with, except for the students.It depends on the class #ELTChat
8:59 pm esolcourses: @hoprea think it depends on the level. Beginners need functional skills first & foremost, higher level s's need more of a challenge #ELTChat
8:59 pm ColinTGraham: I found the most successful activities w/ Japanese Ss were topics where they could safely express an opinion, w/out being personal #ELTchat
8:59 pm Shaunwilden: RT @Marisa_C: So it looks like it's possible to cultivate CT even with younger classes if ony we find appropriate materials! #ELTchat AND activities
9:00 pm Marisa_C: @hoprea Developing a multiple perspective part of it. #ELTChat
9:00 pm BethCagnol: @ShellTerrell #ELTChat @Marisa_C Then get one student to play the Wolf's lawyer" Then summon others for jury duty. Sky's the limit.
9:00 pm InglesPraValer: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Another advantage of CT is that - with our limited time to teach - we give Ss tools to learn things on their own #eltchat
9:00 pm ShellTerrell: Thanks again everyone for a great #ELTChat Off to do the podcast :-)
9:00 pm ColinTGraham: Young children always ask "Why?" which is a good start in CT! #ELTchat
9:00 pm olafelch: RT@hoprea think it depends on the level. Beginners need functional skills 1st & foremost, higher level s's need more of a challenge #ELTChat
9:00 pm Shaunwilden: Good chat, got some new ideas and some really useful quotes for future sessions, he said reflecting critically on #ELTChat Thanks all
9:01 pm EveWeb: Agree. RT @esolcourses: @hoprea think it depends on the level. Beginners need functional skills first & foremost, higher level... #ELTChat
9:01 pm olafelch: RT @Shaunwilden: Good chat, got some new ideas and some really useful quotes for future sessions, he said reflecting critically on #ELTChat
9:01 pm naomi_moir: RT @ColinTGraham: Young children always ask "Why?" which is a good start in CT! #ELTchat> & encouraging this quest is the role of T
9:01 pm CELT_Athens: @esolcourses @bethcagnol Beth put forward the idea of discussions in L1 where possible - I think this is just fine! #ELTChat
9:01 pm ShellTerrell: @bethcagnol Definitely! Fairytales great to play w/ for YL. I have them invent new endings & new ways to get out of jams #ELTChat
9:01 pm hoprea: Thank you all for another great session of #ELTChat
9:01 pm ShellTerrell: RT @Shaunwilden: Good chat, got some new ideas and some really useful quotes for future sessions, he said reflecting critically on #ELTChat Thanks all
9:02 pm deedeeblue: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Asking students questions, ones that don't have obvious right or wrong answers, is one good way to encourage critical thinking. #eltchat
9:02 pm personified: Students drive their learning,teachers observe and facilitate.RT @hoprea: There are different layers in CT. How deep should we go? #ELTChat
9:02 pm Marisa_C: @esolcourses @bethcagnol Beth put forward the idea of discussions in L1 where possible - I think this is just fine! #ELTChat - me again
9:02 pm BloggersELT: and from MeX2...(RTish @Shaunwilden): Gr8chat, she said reflecting critically on #ELTChatThanks all!!! @kalinagoenglish + bloggers
9:02 pm DaveDodgson: Time up for me. Thanks for a stimulating #eltchat: @Marisa_C @ShellTerrell @olafelch@Shaunwilden @EveWeb @hoprea @OUPELTGlobal
9:02 pm ColinTGraham: @CELT_Athens And works if groups can report back summarized versions of the discussions in English to the whole class. #ELTChat
9:02 pm Marisa_C: Wow! That was a stimulating #ELTchat! Thank you all so much for putting those wheels in motion!
9:03 pm olafelch: Well, it looks like we covered a lot of ground again. I'll get the transcript up asap, and the podcast really will appear tomorrow. #ELTchat
9:03 pm SimonGreenall: #ELTChat Thanks from me too.
9:03 pm BethCagnol: @ShellTerrell #ELTCHAT and don't forget about my ultimate fav twist: Politically Correct Bedtime Stories. http://tiny.cc/b4nwbl4mb5
9:04 pm EveWeb: That's why my courses are blended. I go beyond the classroom walls. RT @InglesPraValer: RT @OUPELTGlobal: Another advantage of CT #eltchat
9:04 pm personified: Great discussion today! Many observable critical thinking skills being used and new connections in #ELTChat :)
9:04 pm BethCagnol: RT @Marisa_C: Wow! That was a stimulating #ELTchat! Thank you all so much for putting those wheels in motion!

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